No it was not false advertising. Most of what I saw said things about limited time, not limited quantities which I never thought about the STO beta being a limited thing but I suppose it is, but I was unwilling to jump on any type of sub without trying the game first.

Besides false advertising usually covers they say we will give you product A but instead when you get home you find out they gave you product Q and that was not what you were told you were buying. Money changed hands or whatever. Thats a legal issue, not what we have here.

K, anyway, there is some slight, every so slight evidence of people within the company not being as forthright about what was going down and changing posts in the aftermath to make them read as they wish but google cache caught em according to some news sites so on and so forth.

I had two pre orders for the game, we tried it, we didn’t like it, we didn’t like how this was handled, we canceled our pre orders. As I have stated elsewhere I don’t dig a company that does this kind of thing that seems shady to me. Just my lil ole opinion that’s all.

Wanna see how to handle a launch of a game and lifetime subs go check out Turbine and LOTRO. My wife and I have lifetime subs there because we were able to play the game for a month for free then purchase our lifetime sub if we wanted it. We did and have been happy with our purchase.

*shrugs* Great thing is I don’t need their game, but they wanted my cash and my monthly sub and they got neither.

How bout this: Technically it doesn’t disprove anything I said or saw, being that it is a NEW piece of evidence, and not the original one that would prove your point. Just to drive you nuts, by showing me a brand new offer you have shown me nothing. Now, you could have and mostly likely DID see an offer like that, but what PROOF do you have? EVEN THEN, that DOES NOT MATTER. BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION THEY ALSO SAID IN SEVERAL PLACES “LIMITED OFFER!”

See, I don’t care if they splash brand new offers all over the world, that does not detract from the simple fact that SOME TOOK IT TO MEANING LIMITED IN NUMBER AND SOME MIGHT HAVE TOOK IT TO MEAN LIMITED BY DATE. How much easier, simpler and more basic can I make it for you? They listed BOTH, and now you have your offer back. TELL ME you will buy one after all your protesting…TELL MEEEEEEEEE! If you don’t, I will hear the biggest “wa wa waaaaaaa” cartoon sound EVER.

But, let me get back to calming you down: you have proven everything you have said. Not only were you always right, but you were right in your opinion that everyone considers every piece of virtual fluff items crap and that not a single person with any sense visits forums. Not a single one. Including me and my wife, and most of my friends. But hey, at least you didn’t call us a liar.

Now, don’t obsess so much. Calm down. Don’t quit blogging over this, that would just be…weird.

Again, I thank you for your discussions. I wonder how many “heated” typing fests like this you have had, if you were ready to stop blogging over something like this? This is nothing! lol And yes, it’s FUN. I like discussions. Did I ONCE insult you? Nope. But hey, sometimes I just take the holier, mightier and higher road because I’m SOooOOoooOOooOOooOOooooo nice.

Now, drop it man. Get some sleep! lol

Beau

You’re saying so many things that aren’t correct. You’re retcon’ing by mixing in forum posts that were added after the fact… I’m basing everything I said on what was marketed to me. Not everyone visits forums. No one with any sense visits forums.

But look! Now we have evidence. They’ve put the page back to how it used to be. To what I was basing my decision on:

http://www.champions-online.com/exclusive_specials

As you can see, the only ‘limit’ mentioned is by date.

It’s hard for me to let something go when someone is essentially calling me a liar. I’m weird like that.

Mythic caving in? Or a marketing tactic which may prove to be a stroke of genious?

Hmmm…

No cmere.

Sit down. Yes you.

Take a deep breath. OK? Good? Better? /breeeathe

Ok now help me understand. Someone likes a game so much that they are willing to pay $200+ (if you have to pay for the box as well as the sub) for it BEFORE it is even really released. A regular game is ~$50 with a free month. So since instead of being able to give 4x that amount right now, they have to pay less and stick with a $15 a month bill. And this is worth protesting over and not even buying the game at all? What the hell is going on? If you like the game, support it don’t protest it. What good is that gonna do and who are you punishing but yourself, taking away the opportunity to play a game you like over a technicality? That’s all this is. We all know how companies and “sales” work. There’s always a catch.

Cmon now. Take a deep breath and go have some fun. Play a game that you like. It’s not a big deal. If they follow the LOTRO plan they will offer the lifetime again at some point if you really want it. For now just take the initial $$ savings.

This is from the forums, one of many posts:

“On the 20th they warned people that it would be ending “soon.” On the 24th they announced there would only be 1,000 more. You had 5 days notice to make up your mind. 5 days notice is not 0 notice.”

“Uh, yeah they said they only had 1,000 life-time memberships left. If you bother to read the main page you would’ve known”

There are more, and I have received communications from people that have said that this was true. There are only “I think I saw” about “limited time” ONLY offers. There is actual proof of “limited offer.” Now, let’s play your Devil’s advocate for a second. They announced BOTH limited TIME and limited OFFER. You do not deny “limited offer.” So, what if they posted “limited time, limited offer (limited offer means limited QUANTITY.)” then you would have seen it coming. Well, guess what? THEY ANNOUNCED BOTH, EVEN ACCORDING TO YOU.

I am a little confused as to why someone that works IN virtual goods doesn’t understand limits on virtual items, and why Cryptic can run out of these virtual things. If you do not understand the value of virtual items, or how they can be measured by a company that sells ALL THINGS VIRTUAL, (the game itself, the characters, all virtual) and how that company can set any value and any number they want to on that item, then I cannot help you.

See, you keep using the sentence “I have something for a limited time.” By your own writing, Cryptic did not say “we have subs for a limited time.” They said, once again, “LIMITED OFFER.” And, according to you unless I am missing your evidence somewhere (not saying it doesn’t exist, just for the record) they say “LIMITED OFFER FOR A LIMITED TIME.”

Now, you need to let this go. Seriously. Don’t get so upset about what one Andy Dick blogger thinks. Take a deep breath. If it helps, I do this all the time with players that think that they are right without realizing that EVEN IF YOU WERE, it does not matter in the least bit. Why? Because you did not pay them a single dime. They did not rip you off or pull a fast one.

Recently, Best Buy accidentally sold big TV’s on their website for 10 dollars. People KNEW it was a mistake, but many bought them at that price. When they went to the Best Buy to get the TV’s, the BEst Buy gave them their 10 dollars back and said “Sorry charlie, NO TV.” The customers were mad, but no promises were broken. The customers did not LOSE anything, they were REFUSED SERVICE. That is a right, and always will be a very needed right of businesses.

I am not saying Cryptic did anything like that. I am saying to just let this shit go. Cryptic TOLD THE PLAYERS what the offer entailed, in several places. Even if they just made a mistake in how they communicated, it does not matter. Again, all they have to say is “WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU WANT? YOUR NON-PAID MONEY BACK?” It’s over. The players didn’t move fast enough. The worse Cryptic might have done was to not explain to each individual player, even after saying “limited offer” and even telling people that the quantities were going AWAY (meaning LIMITED), that they might want to get off their ass and PAY THE MONEY OR RISK LOSING OUT.

Now, don’t answer anymore. You know what I have to say. Don’t make me lock this, because I can assure you I can type more and say more than anyone out there.

Beau

If Comcast (or your local service provider) says “Limited time offer: Order by Sept 1 and get internet access for $20/month” by your definition, you’re saying they have a limited number of internet packets to sell.

Right? Because Limited means limited number, according to your definition.

OMF’ing GOD!

YES, if you say “I have limited chapsticks available” then yes, the means your quantity is limited.

But if you say “I have chapsticks for a limited time” that means for a set number of days/weeks/months I’m going to sell chapsticks, after which I will stop selling them. It says *nothing* about the quantity of chapsticks available. Maybe you have a limited quantity, maybe you don’t. Maybe after the end of this period you’re getting lip gloss in and need the display space for that.

And if I say “You can order chapsticks until Sept. 1″ then it means YOU CAN ORDER CHAPSTICKS UNTIL SEPT 1. It says *nothing* about how many chapsticks are available.

Every time you come back, you twist things… I have to assume at this point you’re just being a jerk and enjoying spinning me up. Because your constant mis-reading of what I’m saying simply HAS to be deliberate. So touche, you win, and screw you.

hehe My point is that these “shitstorms” that have “erupted” over issues like this are never that big of a deal. But still, it might seem that way to someone that hears that it is.

Still, I wouldn’t care. If I don’t like an offer, I don’t take it. Unless it’s for a cash shop. OMG I LUV cash shops.

Beau

2) I have these type discussions all the time. Don’t take it too seriously. Remember, this type stuff goes on all the time in bars and no one gets upset.

Beau

If that’s what they’d said, I’d be in total agreement with you and we wouldn’t be having this debate.

The word “number” was never mentioned in the marketing material. What was said was Limited TIME Offer. I’ve said this a dozen times by now but you keep ignoring me.

And I’m not claiming to dictate the value of the geegaws they threw in to the Lifetime membership. I’m sorry if I read that way, I should have said “garbage to me.” I don’t remember what they were, but in my experience, pre-order bonuses usually don’t have long term value. But 8 additional character slots (again, to me) is a huge perk to miss out on.

“But, thanks for the discussions!”

So this was pleasant for you? Can’t say I share the sentiment. I’ve found it frustrating as hell. Like pushing a boulder up a hill. Lots of energy spent. Zippo accomplished.

They said “limited offer until sept. 1stl

You are not going to convince me, either, that just because YOU think that the extra items you get with the 200 dollar special are worthless means that they are. Obviously,they are worth maybe 200 dollars to quite a few people. Point being, you do not dictate the value of those items, and do not determine the “proper” use of the word “limited.”

This is the last you will hear from me on this, its getting time to go home.

But, thanks for the discussions!

Beau

Beta-access wasn’t part of the deal, that came with pre-orders. The deal was $200 for a Lifetime Subscription and 8 additional character slots, plus some other garbage that didn’t matter.

I never did anything to make your cupcake offer shady. I simply pointed out that giving 1 set of details through one transaction medium, and another set of details through a different transaction medium, is bound to cause confusion.

I never said anything about Cryptic’s deal was shady. I was it was handled badly.

I sell virtual goods all the time (well, not me personally, but my company). Our offers are limited with a date cutoff. Limited means “Deadline is this date”. Limited never means “we have x quantity to sell.” If we had x quantity of something to sell, we’d say “Supplies are limited” not “Order by Sept. 1″

So you can repeat YOUR interpretation of what “Limited” means until the sun burns out. It won’t make you correct. When the promotional material said Limited Time Offer, order by Sept. 1st, it won’t mean “we only have x to sell” to most people. It’ll mean “We’re selling these until Sept. 1st.”

Saying, in the forums, where a fraction of your audience will see it “Oh, and by the way we have a limited quantity that we’re willing to sell.” doesn’t change the message that you delivered in your marketing materials. And what about interviews that Emmert gave where he said “You have to order by Sept 1″ while never saying “and supplies are limited.” They put out the message widely that Sept 1 was the deadline to order. The only time they said anything about quantities being limited was in 1 forum post.

See, you are adding a date to my cupcake offer to make it seem like the offer is shady. It is not. “Limited” simply means first come first serve.
If they would have used that language, people would have moved faster.
It is not Cryptics fault that players waited.

Beau

And I’m not saying “No more discounts,” I’m saying “Don’t offer special deals and be ambivalent about the terms, saying 1 thing in one place, and another thing in another place.” because that’s just going to lead to hard feelings, as evidenced by the situation here.

Beau

Your argument seems to be that we should have known not to trust what we were reading, and somehow known to make a point of visiting the forums to see if there were any caveats on the offer. And that we were foolish for not doing so, and deserve to have missed out on the offer because we didn’t know what we didn’t know.

Better they should offer NO discounts, then to offer them in such a haphazard fashion. If they’d never offered these discounts, there wouldn’t be these outcries and this bad PR.

It isn’t *our* fault that they (and they admit this) handled the situation poorly.